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5HTP Absolutely stunned

Discussion in '5-HTP, CBD, CEBT Therapy, SAM-e, Rhodiola, books' started by Quest, Sep 12, 2006.

  1. Quest

    Quest Regular Member

    The Tryptophan made me more tired during the day when Id tried it, so maybe it would do wonders at night...but I did not take it in the evening so I can't comment on that part. As for sleeping I find that my Magnesium before bed always helps me the most. When I dont take it, I dont sleep as soundly. Plus, if Ive taken HTP during the day I would tend to sleep better at night anyway.
    One of my own worst enemies as far as sleep and mid day agitation was B Complex. Yes, its recommended everywhere for anxiety and depression, but in my case it made me jittery even at a 50mg complex. I asked my doctor about it and he said he recommends the B complex for his patients that need the energy to "get up and go" but never in the afternoon or evening as it disrupts sleep. With agitation I never needed "get up and go" LOL Ive tried different brands more times then I can count but its only made things worse for me. So as a tip..watch your intake of too much B if you cannot sleep.
     
  2. bumblebee

    bumblebee New Member

    Hi Quest

    You are so right about the B complex, I've been breaking the pill in half lately...I think its making me anxious. But I think I still need the B's in the am, esp B6 - to help the Tryptophan work (converts to serotonin in the brain?) later in the day I think.

    I did take 1 x 500mg tryptophan last night before bed (around 1am for me) and got some sleep out of it. Still woke up early though.

    What type and strength of magnesium to you take (ie citrate, taurate, glycinate or etc). Do you take it with calcium as well? Bit worried about loose stools/diarrhea...

    That's the thing that is so frustrating you know...my life seems to revolve around a multitude of pills and supplements, and I think everyone will empathise with this...we are afarid to take another one cos of unknown side effects, and yet we are also afraid to give up on a supplement in case its THE one that would help us. My supplements actually cause me anxiety...believe it or not.

    BTW, I still have a bottle of L-theanine..anybody got any suggestions whether I can take that and what effects if any to look out for...considering I am taking 2 x Kira, 1 x tryptophan a day? :smile:
     
  3. sheephead

    sheephead Moderator

    Bumblebee,

    Over time I think you will probably weed out many of the supplements you currently take. A process of 'natural selection' seems to take place over the months and years. I have trialled probably 20-30 different vitamins, minerals and supplements over the past seven or eight years. Most I haven't gone back to, some I used over a period and stopped, some I keep in reserve just in case (including SJW!), one I take regularly as and when I need it (magnesium). Only two do I still take every day (fish oil and a cheap, basic multivit). It may take some time, but I reckon you will gradually rationalise your supplement intake.

    Part of the 'weeding out' process involves working out whether any of the supplements you take have unwanted side effects, eg insomnia and anxiety, and are actually doing more harm than good.. I have dropped high strength B vitamins and high EPA fish oil for this very reason.

    Sheephead.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 12, 2010
  4. Quest

    Quest Regular Member

    Great point! At times my med cabinet looked like a herbal store. I kept a journal and it helped me see my moods over time..what worked..what didnt..side effects etc. I DO agree that taking too much can be overkill and ends up causes worse problems long term.
     
  5. Quest

    Quest Regular Member

    Im wondering why you want to add Theanine in? Being that you are taking Kira AND tryptophan anyway you should be careful. There is such thing as too much serotonin suddenly coming at you. Personally, I would not add Theanine...but thats because you are putting so much in yourself like a blender and you are not going to know what is causing what. Some people DO add several alternatives..and sometimes in a combination they are useless, unless you get a perfect mix going..and that I would advise under the supervision of a doctor. Be very careful...too much can harm you. As far as Theanine, it never did much for me. As for Magnesium..mine is Glycinate. The other one Ive used is a combo calcium/Mag by Rainbow Light which never upset my tummy or caused distress.
     
  6. cloudhead

    cloudhead New Member

    I wasn't able to find anywhere that you actually posted a website for this. However, you did mention at one point to google "integrative psychiatry". The very first result brought up this: http://www.integrativepsychiatry.net/neuro_tests_by_symptom.html
    as you can see, there's a number of tests at varying prices available. Which one would you suggest? I figured the third from the bottom, neurotransmitter test for mood, is the one you were referring to. But would you mind confirming this? Also, would you have any information/advice on getting this covered by insurance.. seems like something my insurance wouldn't be too keen on helping out with.

    And also, I've read through this whole thread and its really piqued my curiosity in 5-htp. I think my situation is slightly different to what it seems like most other posters in here have dealt with. I would categorize my condition as dysthymic. This revolves primarily around my unstable/erratic level of mental clarity. This clarity tends to fluctuate without much rhyme or reason (that I have been able to isolate at least). When I'm not feeling "clear-headed" I become somewhat slow and unable to speak fluidly/without considerable effort. On the other hand, when I am feeling clear-headed, I do just fine; socializing is effortless, I can focus better, and I'm generally sharper . I would say that I spend maybe 60% of my time feeling unclear and 40% clear (or more accurately its on a spectrum, rather than two distinct mental states).

    This randomness has contributed to a social anxiety for me, simply because I never know how I'm going to be in a given social situation down the line: clearheaded and able to function or unclear-headed. This keeps me from developing lasting, meaningful relationships with people, which in turn feeds into my dysthymia. So as you can see, its something of a vicious cycle.
    Now, I've tried talk therapy for quite a while (about 3 years total) and a variety of rx antidepressants, none of which had any positive effects. Then, quite recently, I tried SJW. This helped for about the first 2 months--really stabilizing my mental clarity and allowing me to not be hindered by the frequent bouts of cloudiness. I thought, that I had finally found something that worked for me. And then, the positive effects simply tapered off. So here I am now, still taking the SJW, but not seeing any real benefits anymore, and wanting to try something else. I've read about this tapering off happening to other SJW users, and between what I've read from Kelly who suggests cutting back on the SJW and other users who have suggested trying a different brand (Kira, Perika, Sc27) I had settled on trying a different brand, at potentially a lower dosage. Researching which brand to get on brought me to your thread and well, now here I am. So, what do you think, from both your personal experiences as well as your naturopathy background, do I seem like a case for which this 5-htp might help? Or do you think I should stick to my original plan and pick up a different brand of SJW?

    Thank you so much.
     
  7. Quest

    Quest Regular Member

    Hello : )

    As for the insurance..on the main page of that web addy they list the codes for the tests. You can call your insurance customer service number and they should be able to tell you if it is covered. One step better might be to consider your doctor calling for you and saying that he/or she would like to order the test.
    As far as the "bipolar" slide...again, a doctor would confirm or dismiss it based on your symptoms. However, keep in mind that often times people with typical generalized anxiety disorder can have these moments of brain fog, coupled with clarity. It's almost as if one day can be a "good" day..and the next 2 sort of "off" In my experience I have times where I can concentrate very clearly on whatever tasks are at hand...but if my anxiety acts up...even slightly..it becomes difficult to concentrate which stresses me further. My stress can leave me in a position to be tongue tied or unable to make the simplest of decisions. That alone is certainly enough to make me second guess any social situations I may have on tap. This anxiety/depression is like a rollercoaster. The symptoms are vast and yet unique to certain individuals. ( I have never been diagnosed as bipolar and would doubt that I ever was anyway)
    As for the SJW and HTP, personally I hate to mix supplements if Im looking for an answer to help correct a distinct problem. When combining supplements its hard to tell if its the combo thats working, or one thing that may be causing an unwanted reaction. People do combine the two supplements, but I just never advise it at first.
    Some people just take a tablespoon of flax or fish oil to keep their serotonin up before dabbling with the HTP. Nature's Way is my all time favorite HTP! Its always been the most reliable in my situation. The thing to remember is you do not necessarily need to start on a full dose. Sometimes people are sensitive to it. As for me I have never needed more then 1/2 of that pill at a time. I think its advisable for anyone to start low and work up...give it some time.
    I hope this helps.
    Happy Holidays to you : )
    PS..And yes..the HTP still works for me
     
  8. bumblebee

    bumblebee New Member

    Happy Holidays to all.

    This latest thread posts has brought my attention back to this wonderful site for depression/anxiety sufferers

    Haven't posted for a while, I guess mainly cos my condition has stabilised somewhat in the past 3 months. I'm not perfectly OK (at least I don't believe I am), but I am functioning OK and the anxiety and depression is nowhere near as severe as before.

    Oddly enough, its only the last few days where I've started feeling a little bit of the old fears and dark thoughts coming back.

    I guess I just wanted to give some hope to all out there during this holiday period, that there will be a light at the end of the tunnel. I remember how bad it was at its peak, how I thought there was no hope, no light, no way out of the depression/anxiety. But there is...it takes time, and work.

    I never did continue with the 5htp or tryptophan in the end. (I know its strange that I'm posting in the 5htp section). I guess I was just too anxious that it had more side effects than help. What I beleive helped me is the following-

    *Good therapist - just for the coping strategies alone it was worth it
    *Religious/social/family support
    *Supplements - SJW (SC27 seemed to work for me), fish oil/EPA, multivit, turmeric, magnesium glycinate, B vit

    There is a whole ton of other stuff that is out there that one can be tempted to try out of sheer desperation, I know..cos I've been there, but for me this worked, and I know that there will be something out there that works for somebody else.

    I will endeavour to keep updates.
     
  9. cloudhead

    cloudhead New Member

    So, my 5-htp arrive in the mail (nature's way 50mg) and I've been taking it for about 3 days now. I started off on 50 mg, then moved to 100 mg and now i'm about to do 150. So, what do I have to report? Well, nothing. I literally haven't experienced anything from the supplement. No, improvement or otherwise. Nor have I experienced any of the "jumpiness" described by others. I'm going to continue using this supplement at normal dosages to make sure that I'm giving it a fair shot, but I was under the impression that this was more of an immediate-effect sort of thing. I must say, I'm rather dismayed that I haven't seen any improvements--I was really kind of banking on it.
    I guess my next plan of action will be to try a different brand of SJW (perika, kira or Sc-27) and i'd like to see about having one of those neurotransmitter tests done.
    :frown:
     
  10. Quest

    Quest Regular Member

    If it doesnt do anything..it may not be what you need. Maybe you are deficient in Dopamine for example. Or..maybe you need more serotonin then HTP can offer. Everyone reacts differently. Its all trial and error with these supplements. For example, I have said previously that Id taken Sam e. I read marvelous things about it...many positive ,glowing references to it. I was horrified when I got the eventual reaction that I did from it. It increased Dopamine along with serotonin..which I DID NOT need. Plus it increased my panic. It was a nightmare for me...but is a blessing for others. People should always be aware that just because one thing fails for one person..it might not fail for them. Even with prescription antidepressants..I have seen miracles in people taking Paxil...yet I have also seen nightmares. Keep trying...never give up hope. : )
     
  11. robertz

    robertz Senior Member

    Hi there cloudhead,

    Don't give up. I tried that very same brand and it also did nothing for me. The only brands that work for me are Solgar and Now Foods. You can buy either of them at iherb.com. Both brands are very effective.

    Good luck.
     
  12. Quest

    Quest Regular Member

    Strange how different brands seem to work better for others as well. In my case the NOW brand was a complete failure, did absolutely nothing.. while the Natures Way was stellar. Trial and error again it seems
     
  13. txern41

    txern41 New Member

    ???????

    please elaborate! i have never come across this statement and i've been researching compulsively for a long time. vitamin b-12? you gotta be kidding me. fish oil? you probably know know more than i do but i found this a bit disturbing. i would like more information about this. thanks


    'Fifth, Avoid supplements that can CAUSE Anxiety.
    Vitamin B12, Folic Acid, Calcium and Fish Oil are the top problem starters I see. '
    Multi-B Vitamins can seriously start trouble for some people'
     
  14. Raging_Hangover

    Raging_Hangover Regular Member

    Supplements that can cause Anxiety.


    No, I'm not kidding you. I'm not sure what is "disturbing".
    Vitamin B12 and Folic Acid increase histamine levels, especially the latter. You can find information about this almost anywhere.

    This can be very important to people who have issues with histamine (caused by either a gut infection, food intolerance...etc.....)
    Histadelia/Histapenia are the terms to look out for, and while I don't agree with all the information about Methlyation, some is very sound.

    I have also met and spoken with many people who either have high or low histamine level (check through a lab) and do well (or much better) or supplements geared towards their histamine level.

    Aside from Methylation, Vitamin B12 and Folic acid can also be very stimulating and some with anxiety do not do well with anything stimulating until they have leveled off a bit. That is why I mention the B-Complex in general, many B-Vitamins are stimulating. That is NOT to say they are not useful, but rather to be careful and be aware of how you react to them.

    With Fish Oil, it can cause many reactions that increase anxiety. For some it seems that Fish Oil does not metabolize properly and this somehow causes the anxiety, however it seems to be fine when taken WITH Vitamin E (as this helps metabolize the oil). Next, some people are allergic to fish oil - not to mention fish oil can be high in histamine itself.

    Finally, Calcium is responsible for the contraction of muscle, Magnesium relaxes muscle. Both balance each other other, but calcium in essentially an on switch and magnesium an off switch. Calcium stimulates more then just muscle contraction, and without getting into way too much detail, this can cause anxiety in some.

    These will NOT produce anxiety in all people, BUT they will create it in some people. One must be aware of what could potentially cause issues so they are not making them worse.

    All the reading in the world will not help unless you introduce supplements slowly and see how your body reacts.

    Take Care,
    RH
     
  15. LewBeans

    LewBeans New Member

    I have been taking 5 HTP for about a month after having some trouble with depression. I take 50mg with each meal and carry extras in case I feel the effects wearing off. I can say I have had 0 side effects, my mood has increased, I am more productive at work and I am happy again.

    I have been unsuccessful with SSRI's (zoloft, cipralex and luvox) all caused me major side effects after a few days so I gave up. The only med I "carry" is 0.25mg of Xanax if I am really panicky or forgot to take the 5 HTP. BUT... I haven't taken a Xanax in nearly 3 weeks, so you be the judge.

    I also carry 100mg capsules of L-Theanine for relaxation.
     
  16. Miss M

    Miss M Regular Member

    What an awesome thread!!!

    Hi Quest and all :smile: Thank you so much for creating such an informative thread :dance: I am a real newbie on this site and have just come across this particular thread.

    I have just begun taking some SJW (Kira) and am very hopeful. My problem is moderate depression with some mild/moderate anxiety. My anxiety can effect my sleep as well, at times I can wake up every few hours panicking, this would be if my partner is on a night out and I am waking up to see of he has called me, very sad I know. And the worst thing is, the problem lies with me not him, why should he feel like he has to call to let me know he is home because I have 'issues'?!?:silly:

    So the aim is to really sort it all out. So I am wondering.....should I add some 5-HTP to my dosage of Kira which I am taking 3 times per day?? And if I do add some 5-HTP should I cut back on the Kira dosage? I took Xanax for a week just to try it out a few weeks back when things got really challenging, at that time I was in a part of the world where it could brought over the counter, I liked it but I am more for natural remedies, so I did not go and see my GP to ask about anything similar. Instead I have used this site as a tool to decide what is best for me.

    The 5-HTP sounds promising. The Kira, although I have only been on it for 3 days, seems to have had a calming effect on me. I notice that I am more patient and am having less negative thoughts, however the anxiety is still there. So any suggestions regarding how to combine the two would be greatly appreciated :smile:
     
  17. Miss M

    Miss M Regular Member



    Hi RH...any ideas where I can get 5HTP for a reasonable price?? Also have you seen the Holland and Barret brand?? here is a link: http://www.hollandandbarrett.com/pages/product_detail.asp?pid=200&prodid=229&cid=137&sid=0 Do these look ok??

    I appreciate your time and hope to hear from you soon :smile:

    M
     
  18. florana

    florana Regular Member

    You can get 5-HTP at iHerb which is often cheaper than the UK and offers more range.

    You would have to be very careful mixing it with SJW I think since they both affect serotonin.


    More info on dosage, timing, side effects etc.:
    http://www.raysahelian.com/5-htp.html
     
  19. sheephead

    sheephead Moderator

    Personally, I wouldn't start taking 5HTP just yet. Give the Kira SJW time (say 2-3 weeks) to 'bed in' first. If you then feel you need something further then adding 5HTP would be a possibility.

    Sheephead.
     
  20. Quest

    Quest Regular Member

    I agree. But mixing these alts should not be taken lightly. Because they are not regulated you must be careful. Study up, ask questions..especially to a physician. A family doctor is going to know your history or what might or might not be a dangerous combination for you. Its kind of like we are these mad scientists in our homemade labs drinking smoking potions. Its trial and error as I always say.
     

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